What the what?

Drewski2324

Active Member
Sep 26, 2013
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Ventura County by way of Idaho
So i'm turning to mt SCH family after my ego took a beating last week. I went to my local guns smith and wanted to talk to him about a "budget minded" long range gun. I should have known how the conversation would play out just by the fact we were talking above his $12k 375 Chey Tac. He promptly led me over to another table with a "used" remington 700 sendero in an XLR chassis and Nightforce scope for the bargain price of $5k. This may be someone's version of "budget" but it certainly is not mine(I doubt my truck is even worth $5k!)! My questions are as follows:

Im looking to go sub $2k all in. Glass included. 6.5 Creedmoor.

Would it be worth it to try to piece together a custom rig based on parts acquired or get a gun like the Savage 10 FCP McMillan? The savage is chambered in .308 but its my understanding any .308 can be re-chambered in 6.5 Creedmoor. What does this cost and what is the process?
My goal it to have a sub MOA long range gun that is both suitable for hunting and long range fun.
 
http://www.ruger.com/micros/rpr/spec-18005.html
Throw on a vortex LRHS and you will be close to $2K


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Drewski2324 said:
So i'm turning to mt SCH family after my ego took a beating last week. I went to my local guns smith and wanted to talk to him about a "budget minded" long range gun. I should have known how the conversation would play out just by the fact we were talking above his $12k 375 Chey Tac. He promptly led me over to another table with a "used" remington 700 sendero in an XLR chassis and Nightforce scope for the bargain price of $5k. This may be someone's version of "budget" but it certainly is not mine(I doubt my truck is even worth $5k!)! My questions are as follows:

Im looking to go sub $2k all in. Glass included. 6.5 Creedmoor.

Would it be worth it to try to piece together a custom rig based on parts acquired or get a gun like the Savage 10 FCP McMillan? The savage is chambered in .308 but its my understanding any .308 can be re-chambered in 6.5 Creedmoor. What does this cost and what is the process?
My goal it to have a sub MOA long range gun that is both suitable for hunting and long range fun.
Man Drew, for long range work, it seems like the glass alone would be over 1K new. Did you see sunny417's rifles he's selling over in classifieds? One of those rifles is a Tikka T3 lite in 7mag w vx3 scope. Both the rifles look first class (he's selling a .270 as well) and he's only asking $1K. I'm considering buying the .270 and I don't even need a rifle! Lol
 
I would definately not waste money on a 308 its not a long range cartridge imho. The bc sucks and its liking throwing long darts. You can get a remington 700 sendaro and bed it then throw optics on it for under 2k. I just finished my full custom gun built off a rem 700 action and with everything said and done i spent 2300. Not to far off your budget you just have to play your cards right. You can also do a savage realy cheap. Find a used savage rifle for cheap. You can order a pre chambered finished barrel from multiple barrel makers and mount it yourself. Just get a go and no go gage and an action wrench and mount it. Put a good stock on bed it then optics. Ive shot a few .5 moa rifles built like this for under 1400 dollars. You dont have to spend top dollar to get a very good shooting rifle. My new gun is already shooting just over .5 moa and i havnt even started reloading yet. 6000 dollar rifles dont shoot much better then that.
 
ok to answer your question i think. First lets define long range as 800+ yards under that is mid range or short range. Trust me the first time you do a mid range match at 600 yards it sure feels like long range! then you back up to 1k and all you can think is "hey i cant see the target"

yes you can change a savage 308 to a 6.5C by having a gun smith swap the barrel out and putting another one on. 308's while not as efficient as a 6.5 can shoot plenty far with out much fuss. if you are going to be shooting maybe 600 yards its GREAT! so if you end up buying a gun in 30cal don't kick it to the curb to fast.

You can not build a "long range" custom gun for under 2k. the parts just add up to fast

A good starting point if you want to keep the build on the cheep is to get a rem700 and simply have a good barrel stuck on it and start learning about shooting way far. You can get that done for not to crazy expensive with the bolt trued and a trigger dropped in. Some hard choices have to be made about how heavy to make the gun. That 7lb gun sure is nice to lug up a mountain but its going to beat you up while you target shoot it. inversely that 18lb bench gun is going to be a dream to target shoot but god help you getting out of the truck : )
 
Ok my turn...

First off, if you are going to build a long range gun the model 700 action or a variant is the direction you want to go. Lets take a quick look at basic cost assuming you will start from scratch and are on a budget.

Piece by piece

700 action new $450
recoil lug $40
barrel in the white $300 - $375
barrel chambering $275 + shipping both ways
stock Bell And Carlson 700 BDL S/A M40 Style $250
PTG Trigger Guard for AICS Detachable Box Magazine $130
magazine $50
trigger Rifle Basix or Timney $150
scope mount Weaver $59
rings Leupold PRW $59

Ok - now the above items are good but definitely a budget build and the rifle cost is $1863 (these are real life costs)

Scope Viper HS-T 4-16x44 $569

With the Viper $2432

Ok now a different route of buying a gun and building:

Purchase a Remington 700 Long Range (part 84163) $759
Bell and Carlson M40 tactical stock – solid urethane stock, combined with aramid, graphite and fiberglass
Aluminum bedding block for added accuracy and an extra swivel for bi-pod
26” heavy varmint barrel with matte finish perfectly matched to its high-velocity caliber offerings
X-Mark Pro® externally adjustable trigger system set at 3½ lbs., and featuring super-tight tolerances and mirror-like surface finishes
Magazine capacity – four standard calibers, three magnum


blueprint receiver $160
barrel in the white $300 - $375
barrel chambering $275 + shipping both ways
trigger Rifle Basix or Timney $150
scope mount Weaver $59
rings Leupold PRW $59

Rifle only $1862

Scope Viper HS-T 4-16x44 $569

With Viper $2431

And none of the above includes taxes, Cerakote paint, bedding material and challenges that may arise during the build.

I think $2K is a wee bit unrealistic. It can be done but you will need some really good hookups along the way.

Hopefully El Matavenados will chime in. He built a very respectable rifle for a total of $2303.

Here is his Budget build post - http://southerncaliforniahunting.com/huntersforum/index.php/topic,7539.0.html
 
http://southerncaliforniahunting.com/huntersforum/index.php/topic,7389.0.html

make you a good deal on this if you are wanting to go that route
 
Perfect. Thank you guys for helping me. I should have said I do get an "inside" deal on Vortex optics. My plan for the gun was around $1500. I'm not above doing any work I can myself. Now in saying that I only planned on bedding the stock myself. I'm not against going over that $2k mark but my goal was to keep under.

NBK- Is the action on the Remington 700 Long range much different from any other 700? Could I bring my cost down with a used 700? Or would that be too risky?

Aeon- You are right. Im looking 800+yards. I have an old 30-06(1903 springfield) that I can shoot pretty well out to the 500-600 yard range and I do not plan to hunt at distances any further than that. That old 30-06 beats the hell out of me though. I personally have never even shot the 6.5 Creedmoor but it is highly recommended in almost all forums and ballistically it checks all the boxes. As for the weight i am definitely looking to stay in the 9-11 lb range.

Bloodlover- How deep did you go in customizing your 700?

Bonjour- I did see that listing. I have looked at probably about 20 times! I have almost PM'd him several times because it is so close to what I want but just not the look or the cartridge I prefer.

Taft- That gun was not even on my radar but it is now! I have read articles about it but I did not know the price. Much cheaper than I assumed it would be.

Baboltin- I am definitely interested. If it is still available when I actually make my decision i'm in. Feel free to PM me if you want to sweeten the pot! :-*
 
I personally picked up a savage model 11 6.5 creedmoor with scope for 500$. sold the scope for 100$ so now I essentially had a 400$ rifle, then toppd it off with my bushnell elite tactical 6-24x50mm ffp mil/mil with G2 reticle, nightforce 20 moa base and seekins precision rings, harris bipod, triad tactical stock pack. all in all I'm into this gun for around 1400$ right now that as it sits right now shoots consistent 5 shot groups with factory hornady 140 grain amax out of its 22" tube at an average of .72in at 100 yards, I'm certainly not complaining about that. and once I put the xlr element on there I'm sure the groups will tighten up a bit.

I use this gun to shoot out at pala maxed out to 890yds there and I lug it around the hills to hunt here as well and am a firm believer that if you use it enough you wont notice its weight. I'm very happy with my "budget" build and wouldn't change any of the decisions I have made. cant wait to get my xlr element on there that's the last step.
 
I had my action fully blueprinted with the bolt handle welded. Soon will have the bolt fluted with a larger knob put on. Then had my krieger barrel threaded and fitted to my action. Cost of gunsmithing was 850 with cerakote. I had the action already so if i were to do it over i would spend an extra 100 bucks and get a defiant or big horn action. They are a little over the 1k mark if u shop right. Like i said before u can do a savage 110 build for alot cheaper because of the barrel nut set up. i love remington and if u want to go that rought u can buy remington 700 sendaro wich comes with an hs precision stock and xmark trigger. They are very nice rifles for around a 1k. You can bed it add optics for 1500. If u decide to do a custom stick with rem 700 winchester 70 or savage 110. Theres plenty of aftermarket parts. Savage is definately the cheapest and easiest. If u go ththe prechambered finished barrel rout.
 
You have received some good replies so far. Some of my response is going to go against some of this good advice, so take it with a grain of salt. You also need to know that my education in long range shooting and rifle building was obtained from the International University of Interwebs and Youtube. I have built 1 rifle, and I haven't shot it beyond 713 yards. That being said, here goes...

1. Definitions. Aeon and others have defined long range, short, and mid-range. Extreme long range is defined on some sites as "beyond 1000 yards". Then, there's long range shooting vs. long range hunting. You said that you are interested in hunting out to 500-600 yards. Let's stretch that to 700 yards, just for fun.
2. A few weeks ago, my friend and I were in the desert shooting our rifles out to 335 yards. I with my custom build (Howa 1500 rebarreled in 260 Rem, which is very similar to the 6.5 Creedmore) and he with his Remington 700 police (don't know the exact model) in .308. He knocked over the steel target, so we started looking for other things to shoot. I said, "hey, you see that rock way up there on the hill?" My rangefinder won't reach that far, so I spotted while he walked his shots onto it. Within a few rounds, he was nailing that rock dead center with every shot. He doesn't even have mil dots to guide him- he just did some Kentucky windage holdover magic. Later, I got on Google Earth and found that rock, and it was 713 yards. I'm estimating that the rock was 24-30" in diameter, so while that's nothing spectacular, it was fun, and taught us a lot. My point is this: a stock .308, unbedded, nothing custom, that can deliver patterns consistently under 1 MOA is plenty accurate enough for big game hunting out to 700 yards.
3. When building a rifle, it's super easy to lose sight of reality. Long ago, NBK advised me "just buy a Tikka and be done with it!" After having sunk nearly $2500 into a custom build, that advice haunts me! Easily sub-moa guns, can be had for $600-750, throw some glass, a bipod, and a few other accessories, and you could be shooting deer at 700 yards for $1100.
4. Cartridge selection: you're looking at the 6.5 CM, which is very similar to 260 Rem. I may be mistaken, but ammo (or brass) is more readily available for the 260 Rem. And if you can't find 260 brass, you can easily form it from .308 cases. That's how I started, until a friend gave me over 200 spent 260 cases! 8)
5. Here is an article that will give you an idea of a true "budget" build can look like: http://www.longrangehunting.com/articles/long-range-rig.php
There are many opinions given in this article that will contradict some of the good advice you have received, while bolstering other advice. For example, the Savage/Stevens action. The prices in the article are now dated (I don't think you'll find a stripped Stevens for $150 these days), bit I did recently see a Savage on Gunbroker sell for $215. I don't think he mentioned it, but many discussions of budget builds include the SWFA Super Sniper scope: http://swfa.com/SWFA-SS-10x42-Tactical-30mm-Riflescope-P499.aspx. For $300, if it lives up to its reputation, it's a good deal.
6. So let's talk about a custom, budget build. As stated in the aforementioned article, you need binoculars for long range hunting. Let's assume you already have that. You also need a rangefinder that will CONSISITENTLY, every time, give you the precise distance to your target at the ranges you intend to hunt. You probably already know that you will get that kind of performance at less than half of the advertised range listed by the manufacturer. If it says it can range reflective targets at 1000, you might get consistent ranges on real targets at 4-500. Right now, I can't truly hunt or shoot at long range, because my rangefinder is really only good out to 350 yards (and it's a $350 Leupold!). Here's a basic build, not including accessories (case, sling, scope caps) and other incidentals or paint:
Donor Savage - $250
Criterion barrel from Northland Shooters Supply (NSS) - $300
Rifle Basix trigger from NSS - $85
Boyd's Stock - $100
Harris Bipod with tilt, locking handle - $150
Vortex Viper HS-T - $550
Vortex rings - $30
Vortex bubble level - $30
Nightforce or Talley 20 MOA scope base - $60
Tools - $100+

Total (not including tax, shipping, DROS, etc.) $1655

Alternatively, you could order a Brux barrel for $285 and have it chambered and installed by a good gunsmith for $275. You wouldn't need the aforementioned tools, so that brings you to $1815.

I would also recommend a compensator. Those vary in price, but let's say you spend $100 on that, I think you could get it mounted for $50, bringing you to $1965.
 
I do agree with the last post as far as a realistic hunting rifle out to 700 yards or so. I get busted on as well for going against the grain on things like this. Heck I grab my 45-70 sharps with no glass and do 3" groups at 500 yards with lead wad cutters. So to say that one must spend 2000 or more on a gun to shoot 700 yards gets to me. I'm not saying don't get the best you can afford but get what you can and learn to shoot it under pressure in the cold in the wind and get some lead down range. Don't sweat the small stuff. My 800 yard ar10 with glass did not cost even close to 2000 bucks.
 
The way i look at it is if hes asking about long range guns then he probably wants to build one. If you want to build a gun then go for it. If u want a great out of the box long range gun then get a remington 700 sendaro and youll have a 1k yard gun ready to go. I built my gun because i wanted a gun that would shoot better then i can so im not limited by my firearm. Just research the right caliber. A 6.5 or 7mm cal gun is going to make long range shooting alot easier. Alot less drop and wind deflection. Once i shot a 260 and 7mm i got rid of the 308 right away. Just run some basic ballistics on a ballistics calculator and that will teach u alot.
 
I would say that I like the idea of a "build". Like most my tastes are above my pay scale but for some reason I enjoy the different options. The gun I want I have built a thousand times in my head but I am finally getting to the point where I can put my plan into action. Of course I have seen production guns right off the assembly line that will undoubtedly shoot better than I can but they just won't be "mine" in the same way a gun built by me would be.

Does anyone know if the market for gun parts is worth taking into consideration? For example, I buy used rifle A, rechamber, new barrel the works then sell the old barrel and stock to recoup some of the money I sunk into the actual build?
 
U can try to resale parts but to be ohnest no one wants to buy parts off of stock rifles. U can get rid of them but its not worth ur time. Stock barrels 50 bucks and stocks 25 maybe fifty. U can get a little bit but dont count on the money. I wanted to build my rifle for the same reason i wanted my own gun. Fine firearms has rem 700 actions. You can go the stock rifle rout thats what i did. I bought my rem 700 for 400 bucks. FinE firearms has actions for 450. I know its hard to justify the money but im really going to advise u to get a custom action. After you blueprint flute ur bolt and add your larger knob u can spend 1000 dollars. A custom action will need no truing and comes with fluted bolt oversized handle and usually has a rail machined into the reciever. I would look into it a little before u choose. I know 1000 dollars is alot to think of for your reciever but you will spend that much on a rem 700 reciever in the end. I have 700 into my reciever without bolt fluting so if i were to do it over i would just by a custom action. Food for thought but what ever u build will be your gun. One hard aspect i had to get over was not to skip to save money. U dont have to get the most expensive stuff but shop smart.
 

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