What the?!?!

[Drewski2324]

I have an old Springfield 1903 A3 in .30-06. I am trying to get an accurate load developed for hunting. I took a once fired piece of brass and hand seated the bullet into the casing so I could get the distance to the lands. I closed the bolt and it didn't even push the bullet in at all. Zero. I measured it at 3.9" ish to the ogive and in actuality it could be longer than that when I actually find the lands.

Can it really be that worn out? Am I shooting .30-06 out of a 300 win mag? My dad purchased this rifle from a pawn shop in the early 1980's and it had already been sporter-ized. They were selling it as a .30-06. The barrel does not have any marking on it whatsoever. Obviously I have to take it to a gunsmith to get it checked but I am at a loss as to what is going on. I hear of target shooters chasing the lands but what if there are no lands to chase? Anybody have any ideas?

 

[Snake Charmer]

Do a chamber cast, That'll tell you the cartridge it is chambered for and the distance from the neck to the lands. You can probably find the chamber cast material at Midway

 

[Drewski2324]

Will do. I was not familiar with that stuff. Looks cool.

 

[Aeon]

have you fired it with a 30-06 cartridge yet? if you are worried its not a 30-06 do not fire it till you check. if you did already and it went boom and the case came out looking like it went in minus the bullet then you are prob good to go

The Hornady Lock-N-Load Overall Length Gauge and the 30-06 case and you can check your distance...


cost ya 40 bucks for the gauge and case

 

[iupa1]

I have an old Springfield 1903 A3 in .30-06. I am trying to get an accurate load developed for hunting. I took a once fired piece of brass and hand seated the bullet into the casing so I could get the distance to the lands. I closed the bolt and it didn't even push the bullet in at all. Zero. I measured it at 3.9" ish to the ogive and in actuality it could be longer than that when I actually find the lands.

Can it really be that worn out? Am I shooting .30-06 out of a 300 win mag? My dad purchased this rifle from a pawn shop in the early 1980's and it had already been sporter-ized. They were selling it as a .30-06. The barrel does not have any marking on it whatsoever. Obviously I have to take it to a gunsmith to get it checked but I am at a loss as to what is going on. I hear of target shooters chasing the lands but what if there are no lands to chase? Anybody have any ideas?

U have a pic of the rifle?

 

[Drewski2324]

have you fired it with a 30-06 cartridge yet? if you are worried its not a 30-06 do not fire it till you check. if you did already and it went boom and the case came out looking like it went in minus the bullet then you are prob good to go

The Hornady Lock-N-Load Overall Length Gauge and the 30-06 case and you can check your distance...


cost ya 40 bucks for the gauge and case

Actually on Saturday after I tried to find the lands I ordered one. I think it will be in on Thursday. I have been shooting this rifle since 1995 with .30-06 and the cases do not come out deformed. Maybe this thing is just so shot out that it needs to be re-barreled again.


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[xjon]

I took a once fired piece of brass-I measured it at 3.9" ish to the ogive and in actuality it could be longer than that when I actually find the lands.

What tool did you use to measure to ogive? Once fired brass- was the neck sized to give some grip to the bullet or is it free sliding?

 

[Drewski2324]

What tool did you use to measure to ogive? Once fired brass- was the neck sized to give some grip to the bullet or is it free sliding?

I measured the ogive with the Hornady comparitor I think is the name. I sized the neck to have just a little tension without jaming the bullet into the lands. I will admit it was very rudimentary and there is a chance the barrel could have pulled the bullet out a little on extraction but I did try to take my time and feel for any pressure I put on the bolt.

 

[Drewski2324]

U have a pic of the rifle?

Here are a couple pics. Nothing detailed. Let me know if you would like to see something specific.

 

[xjon]

I measured the ogive with the Hornady comparitor I think is the name. I sized the neck to have just a little tension without jaming the bullet into the lands. I will admit it was very rudimentary and there is a chance the barrel could have pulled the bullet out a little on extraction but I did try to take my time and feel for any pressure I put on the bolt.

Are you using the gauge "red stick with the grey slider" with the comparator? Doesn't sound like you are. If you don't have it then look up on youtube other ways to measure. I believe theres methods involving sharpie and even candle soot have been used.

 

[Bowman]

When I use to work in Inspection department, Fabrication and Machine shop.
when verify (Inspecting ) precision parts. if the results were shaky, I would do three or more checks on the parts. and the figure out an other inspection method to get the same results. measure twice cut once.Good Practice.
the Gage and using the fired casing with a bullet should agree on the test results. if not then one of the methods is in accurate or there is a procedure problem, not done correctly.
My 2 cents

 

[xjon]

Using OAL gauge.

No OAL gauge- no problem..

Smoking a bullet or you can just use a sharpie.


I use the OAL gauge.

 

[Bowman]

blue dykem would work great to , and cheap

 

[Drewski2324]

Are you using the gauge "red stick with the grey slider" with the comparator? Doesn't sound like you are. If you don't have it then look up on youtube other ways to measure. I believe theres methods involving sharpie and even candle soot have been used.

No I was not. That is what AEON also recommended and I did order one that should be here today. The tool I used is one made by Hornady that clamps on one end of your calipers and has different inserts depending on bullet size. Tonight I should get an accurate reading with the OAL gauge.

 

[Drewski2324]

When I use to work in Inspection department, Fabrication and Machine shop.
when verify (Inspecting ) precision parts. if the results were shaky, I would do three or more checks on the parts. and the figure out an other inspection method to get the same results. measure twice cut once.Good Practice.
the Gage and using the fired casing with a bullet should agree on the test results. if not then one of the methods is in accurate or there is a procedure problem, not done correctly.
My 2 cents

i totally agree. I'm not going to shoot the gun until I do multiple measurements to figure out what is going wrong.

 

[xjon]

i totally agree. I'm not going to shoot the gun until I do multiple measurements to figure out what is going wrong.

More important for your case than an OAL gauge would be a headspace guage. Even a go-nogo gauge.


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[baboltin]

More important for your case than an OAL gauge would be a headspace guage. Even a go-nogo gauge.


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How do you get the headspace measurement ?

 

[xjon]

https://www.brownells.com/gunsmith-...ace-gauges/go-no-go-gauge-sets-prod26876.aspx


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[Drewski2324]

Well USPS decided to ship my Midway order Via Puerto Rico so it just came in. I will check out the gun tonight.

 

[Drewski2324]

Ok so the above length to the ogive I made an idiot mistake and forgot to minus the comparator body from the measurement. The actual measurement is 2.975" to the ogive to the lands. Still way longer that recommended. The pic attached is of a dummy round i made just to verify and you can see how far down the bullet that lands touch.


So now my question is this: How far is too far to chase the lands? I loaded up 15 to try another load development and even going 0.050" off the lands I couldn't eject a un-fired cartridge. I had to drop down to 2.775" for it to clear reliably if the cartridge was unfired.