First Time in Cleveland National Forest

[smokindice]

Looking for advice. I am going down to So-Cal for a family vacation in early May, just on the tail end of the spring Turkey season. I will have one day for a turkey hunt, which I know I know is ridiculous and nearly impossible but if nothing else its an excuse for me to go out in the wilderness just before sunrise and enjoy the sights and sounds. Moreover my brother in law might tag along as a spectator, so if I can convert him I will have a built in hunting buddy. So lots of good opportunities even if I don't see a bird.

I am not looking for anyone's spot, just looking for guidance of where to start. I have been reading and looking at maps around Palomar Mountain, areas north of Eagle Peak Road. My most basic question is, where should I park to hike in and do I need an adventure pass? I want to hike in a few miles using OnX to find a flat or clearing, listen and try some calls out, but having no time to scout and having never been to CNF, I have no idea where to start. I will be closer to the Northern part of the forest but the drive to the southern half is not much further. I do not expect to bag a bird, but if I can hear one and try to call back that would be equally exciting to me.

Advice, thoughts, guidance?

Thanks All!

 

[Jeremy]

I just realized I signed in with the wrong account. When I first found this website I must have made a log in and promptly forgot and made another one later on my phone, that explains why I couldn't find my post on my profile on my phone when my computer had a different username.

Anyway Jeremy=Smokindice Hi everyone

 

[ilovesprig]

Jeremy,

Welcome to SCH...At the NWTF meeting last, the boys said they all either saw or heard turkeys in the CNF...May is late, but our breeding season can be long...You've got OnX...So that's a great start on finding the out of the way CNF spots...Lake Henshaw and Julian are the hubs of our turkeys down here....Good luck.

 

[smokindice]

Jeremy,

Welcome to SCH...At the NWTF meeting last, the boys said they all either saw or heard turkeys in the CNF...May is late, but our breeding season can be long...You've got OnX...So that's a great start on finding the out of the way CNF spots...Lake Henshaw and Julian are the hubs of our turkeys down here....Good luck.

Is lake henshaw part of CNF? Or does it just have huntable land near it?

I also plan to call the national Forest service to ask about non-hunting guests. As I understand it as long as they don't Helo with the hunt they can hike along. So no glassing, no calling, no carrying ammo, no breaking down the animal, etc. Anyone else have non-hunter friends tag along with them? I don't want to get him in trouble.

 

[TrapLine]

No wonder I couldnt get that screen name, lol.

 

[ilovesprig]

Is lake henshaw part of CNF? Or does it just have huntable land near it?

I also plan to call the national Forest service to ask about non-hunting guests. As I understand it as long as they don't Helo with the hunt they can hike along. So no glassing, no calling, no carrying ammo, no breaking down the animal, etc. Anyone else have non-hunter friends tag along with them? I don't want to get him in trouble.

Your partner CAN DO all those things...You need to read the hunting regulations backwards and forwards...Might save you some bread down the road.

ps...Lake Henshaw area is exactly what implies....An area around Lake Henshaw that is CNF.

 

[DanSanDiego]

Please look into this further because I very well could be wrong.
My understanding is that having a ‘method of take’ qualifies someone as hunting. Ask about that to be certain.
A ‘method of take’ is any harvesting instrument: rifle, bow/arrow, hand gun, air rifle, slingshot, etc, possibly even a knife.
So if that is correct then your friend would just need to not have a ‘method of take’ on him while he accompanies you on your hunt.
Binos, helping you after the kill, etc should be fine if what I’ve said above is correct.

 

[TheGDog]

That doesn't make any sense. As long as they don't have a legal method of take at their disposal, how can they be considered hunting? And even if they did have a weapon which *could* be a legal method of take... Besides... they have the right to self-defense, no? And I don't think there's any law on enjoying your optics to view nature, otherwise lots of people birdwatching would have a problem, right? Of course they can carry ammo. They can even carry lead ammo! There just can't be any firearm available which shoots that lead ammo. Although they can have a weapon which shoots that lead ammo if it's their CCW weapon and they have a CCW license. Why wouldn't they be able to carry non-lead ammo on them? Why would you need them to be able to carry ammo for you? How much ammo do you think you need out there? Most of hunting is just spent carrying the weapon without firing a shot. They doing the actual calling? Now THAT would probably be considered crossing the line since they'd actually sorta proactively be part of the pursuit. But yeah... people take their kids out with 'em when they go out hunting all the time. Before they even have their license... just so they can learn stuff.

If the friend is leary about carrying a weapon, and getting into possible trouble for that... then just have them carry a self-defense pistol. And just to be sure... give a call to whichever Ranger station governs the area you're heading to and bounce these questions off them since you never know how retarded and misinformed certain offices can be.

 

[nicapopolis]

Nope. They can call as well.

Your BIL will have a good time. He just can't carry a gun as if he is hunting.

 

[smokindice]

Thanks all for the input! Sounds like he can do more than just hike and reap any rewards from my work

He does not have a firearm to his name so I don't need to worry about him carrying anything anyway. My main goal was if we get stopped by a ranger there would be no question around our intentions to avoid any unnecessary hassle, but I agree with the thoughts here in general, but often times what should be allowed and how each ranger interprets the regs can vary, so I lean towards playing it safe. I would love to let him try some calls though, really feel like he is part of the hunt.

 

[Bowman]

Should be ok if he is not carring.

 

[DingoDog127]

eagle peak rd area gets slammed by everyone if there are birds in there they will be long gone after opening day. Yes there is public land around certain parts of Lake Henshaw but there is also a private land owned by the water district and they patrol it make sure not to trespass. Your best bet is to use ON-X as suggested locate public land adjacent to private areas that hold birds and try and call them over to the public. no one will give you any specifics other than that on an open forum - wish you the best of luck.

 

[smokindice]

eagle peak rd area gets slammed by everyone if there are birds in there they will be long gone after opening day. Yes there is public land around certain parts of Lake Henshaw but there is also a private land owned by the water district and they patrol it make sure not to trespass. Your best bet is to use ON-X as suggested locate public land adjacent to private areas that hold birds and try and call them over to the public. no one will give you any specifics other than that on an open forum - wish you the best of luck.

That is plenty of guidance for me! It's a big Forest so having even a starting point to hike in to is enough for me. It is late in the season as well so if there are no gobblers left I will just enjoy the sunrise. I figure I might as well take advantage of staying just a few miles away and get out into the back country for a day so next time I go for Turkey I won't be starting from scratch.

Thank you again!

 

[smokindice]

For those curious, I called the dept of fish and wildlife. They transferred me to an analyst who said a non hunter can tag along but can't call can't look for game and can't carry a method of take, fire arm, bow, etc. I asked about after the take, field dressing, packing game out and he was not sure, referred me to the law enforcement division.

When they called me back I got a much different story. Non-hunter he said can call, glass for game, carry out, basically anything except carry a method of take, including a fire arm, bow, slingshot, etc. I trust the game warden as he would be the one I might meet in the field, so my buddy can participate in most of the hunt really, so that should be more fun for him.

 

[smokindice]

Well we didn't see or hear any turkeys, but had a fun time nevertheless. Started out before sunrise, hiking in to Love Valley in the CNF. The hike in was a breeze. When we got to the valley we hiked around the edges looking for sign, calling and sitting awhile at each location waiting to hear anything answer us back but never heard a peep of the thunder chicken variety.

We took a few hours to hike along the edges of the valley, found a nice little pond with some ducks. Waited their awhile but still no turkeys talking.bwe packed it up a bit before the afternoon because we had to get back to the wives and kids. We cut across the valley to try and find a high point to look around but the weeds and grass had grown so tall it was up to our thighs. The morning dew had burned off by then but the greenery was soaked and in turn we got drenched. My socks felt like a wet sponge.

Next time I would try going a bit lower in elevation closer to lake henshaw but I didn't see any access points so I would think we would just need to park on the side of the road and hike in and hope.

On the way out there was some construction and I asked the construction worker if he ever sees turkeys around here. All the time he said...of course we didn't see any.

Still a good day though!

 

[smokindice]

 

[ilovesprig]

'dice,

I don't know why, but in my 23 years of hunting that area for turkeys, I've never seen or heard a turkey in Love Valley (trail cams too)....It's got everything turkeys need (water, food, & oak trees)....I drove in there last summer with the CNF biologist (Jeff Welles) and the NWTF biologist (Kevin Vella)....And despite it being dry and having a good pond of water, there wasn't one turkey track around it (there were deer tracks).

The lower areas around the lake (next to VID) certainly has turkeys....And produced a couple again this year.

A couple of pix from LV.

.

 

[smokindice]

Good to know! Maybe next year I will try this area again. I thought if we got I'm the valley we could find a path out, but every clearing led to a dead end with brush so thick we couldn't get through.

What is VID?

 

[ilovesprig]

Good to know! Maybe next year I will try this area again. I thought if we got I'm the valley we could find a path out, but every clearing led to a dead end with brush so thick we couldn't get through.

What is VID?

Yep....Surrounding habitat is classic chaparral....VID stands for Vista Irrigation District....Do you have OnxMaps?

 

[Bowman]

View attachment 39248
View attachment 39249

Nice area..
Good report brother